In the weirdest Oscar year ever, Kung-Fu Panda swept the Annie Awards and Wall-E, a film that holds the record for the most nominated categories for an animated film at the Oscars, goes home empty-handed.
No joke, read it and weep, as Variety’s Peter Debruge reports:
Fifteen-category victory marks a coup for DreamWorks Animation, which hasn’t seen one of its CG features take the Annies’ top prize since 2002 (though they did share the stage with Aardman three years back for stop-motion “Wallace & Gromit: The Curse of the Were-Rabbit”), especially since the show has correctly forecast the Academy’s taste all but once since the Oscars introduced its feature animation category.
Well guess what, Annies, get ready for number two. Perhaps they did this because of Pixar burn-out but it’s rather self-hating I’d say to give a sweep to Kung-Fu Panda after a film like Wall-e has broken new ground with the general population. This is not to discount Kung-Fu Panda for being good, it is good, it just isn’t one of the best. films. of. the. year.
A travesty.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=69tX-vMn9-M[/youtube]
153 Responses for "You’ve GOT TO BE KIDDING"
Kung Fu Panda is better than WALL-E.
Just don’t get the WALL-E love…
Wait — THIS is the weirdest Oscar year ever?
Haven’t people been complaining that’s it’s been too predictable so far?
“Kung Fu Panda is better than WALL-E.
Just don’t get the WALL-E love…”
Just because you don’t get it doesn’t mean it isn’t real. One movie is simply better than the other. Kung Fu Panda is one cliche after another. It’s a “cute” story but it’s nothing revolutionary, groundbreaking or interesting. It is a typical animated comedy. Nothing more than that.
Haven’t people been complaining that’s it’s been too predictable so far?
THe end result has been predictable but it started out very strangely, with all of the big Oscar movies being held back until the last minute – The Dark Knight being shut out of the race — the outcome is predictable because the choices are, ultimately, so limited.
Yet more proof that there are far too many pointless awards ceremonies out there.
When he collects his Oscar (who knows, maybe two) on February 22, I can hardly imagine Andrew Stanton going to think, “Yeah, this is nice, but I really wish I’d won the Annie Award.”
If they really wanted to buck the trend, why didn’t they at least go for “Waltz With Bashir?” That would have proved some kind of artistic point. This is just sheer (envy-induced?) perversity.
Epic fail.
If the Oscars really want to destroy their already damaged reputation, then they should award Kung Fu Panda as Animated Feature and anyone but Ledger as Supporting Actor.
Stop giving them ideas, GFH!
This could be one of the most stupid ignorant choises ever made by an award organization. It´s official. Annie Award has no credibility.
Voting for Kung fu Panda over Wall-E is bizarre but look at the nominations, they´re even worse! They have 5 spots for nominations and they couldn´t make room for Thomas Newmans wonderful score for Wall-E!
In the screenplay category Wall-E is overlooked for the likes of Madagascar 2!!! What the hell is this? Sorry for my rant but I think this is ridiculous.
Annie Award tries to promote itself like the highest honor in animation, good luck with that one after these horrible nominations and wins. We can complain all we want about the Oscars and what they choose to nominate and vote for, but I believe they would never make a blunder like this!
Sorry, Guy Lodge…
When he collects his Oscar (who knows, maybe two) on February 22, I can hardly imagine Andrew Stanton going to think, “Yeah, this is nice, but I really wish I’d won the Annie Award.”
No, but the Annies are animation peers – this is a disgusting slap in the face to Wall-E and Pixar. It’s a rebellion against Pixar’s dominance and it is wholly inside and incestuous, not dealing with the bigger picture at all. I think Stanton would feel something about this because it seems to personal.
Even if you didn’t like Wall-E and you felt it was a little cold and needed more dialogue, there is no way you can still say Kung Fu Panda is better. Better go with Bolt, cause Panda is just for stupid people. Seriously, I admit the animation is really good, and it has has some nice parts, but overall it’s not that funny, it’s not that intelligent and it’s not that entertaining even. Even kids would be bored.
Worse than the year they pick Cars over Happy Feet…..
Sasha: I totally agree… it’s outrageous. I’m just saying Stanton would be better off ignoring them. It’s plainly a decision borne out of peer envy, so if anything, he should take it as some kind of weird accidental compliment.
I actually liked Kung Fu Panda better. It was funnier and more entertaining than Wall-E. And there’s a lesson, too!
I think Wall-E, despite its intents and lofty goals, wasn’t that entertaining nor visually creative (Short circuit’s No.5 and a black space for outer space.) That’s two strikes. And the love story was cliche.
Let’s just say I am not surprised.
I liked Kung Fu Panda but I (or my 9 yr old cousin) weren’t loving it. It didn’t feel special to me. Fun & enjoyable yeah but so was Bolt, lol. Wall-E is in another class. The Academy knows that, the critics acknowledged it higher than any other 2008 release & the general public’s love for it does the same.
The Annie’s are sending a message that the best film doesn’t need to win. And it didn’t. To be honest was Kung Fu Panda even the second best. No, Waltz with Bashir was.
Both Wall-E & Waltz with Bashir will win Oscar’s & Kung Fu Panda goes home empty.
The answer is obvious. Take a look at the sponsors of the award. Dreamworks is a “Gold Sponsor” while Disney and Pixar are a step down in the “Silver Sponsors”. DWA bought and paid for each and every one of those awards.
Oh, and “WALL-E” isn’t the only animated film with 6 nominations. “Beauty and the Beast” had 6 too back in 1991.
they are ALL under drugs, this year, from this to love for slumdog…
absurdity…that’s the word for this year’s prizes season…
shame on them all…
I haven’t seen Kung Fu Panda, but its choice over WALL-E does seem politically motivated.
That’s obvious – it’s always about the money.
Just one thing though – are we kids to like a movie just because it has a lesson. If it’s that Wall-E has a lesson for us all..
Come on, RichardA, get real!
#10.
Precisely. To name “Kung Fu Panda” as the best of the year, OK, it’s their choice, it’s not really a problem. But to snub Wall-E in ALL categories, not giving a single and miserable award to it, well this is not a natural choice. It’s a strategy to send a message.
A grotesque message of slap, boycott, resentment, to a movie that was not only a blockbuster and also a favorite with the critics (all over the world, but specially in USA, probably the number 1 movie of the year, adding all lists, rankings, etc), but something that show that mainstream cinema, that an animated feature, could be a cultural phenomenon.
Stanton could be feeling very sad at this moment – or not – but at the end of the day, it’s just one of these type of decisions that go against who vote.
I definitely enjoyed Kung Fu Panda WAY more than Wall-E, but this just seems bizarre. My opinion is definitely of the minority kind…….except among Annie members? o_O
Sasha, everyone that thinks different from you is wrong? You’re not very democratic.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ah ah ha ho ho hee ha ha…
And I thought, MY jokes were bad.
As much as I don’t buy into this ‘Wall-e is the second coming of Christ’ thing, I have to admit that Kung-fu Panda was the inferior film to Wall-e. And visually, Wall-e was an amazing film, no doubt about it. I’m surprised it didn’t win a thing. Not anything? I mean, even to a guy like me, that’s cold.
I agree with Alfredo. It isn’t fact that PIXAR is the greatest thing on Earth. Faith and opinion are not absolute. IMO, Miyazaki is a much better and much more imaginative animator than any of PIXAR’s animators. But hey, that’s just my opinion.
Ridiculous. Kung Fu Panda is enjoyable, but fails to enter anyone’s Top 10
Wall*E is a masterpiece. What are they thinking! If it fails to win Animated Feature, Oscars this year are a joke.
Actually, not a joke, but down right disgusting.
T.
They also awarded a voice-over award for the Jar Jar Binks character. If this is the best the Annies can come up with it calls into question the entire set of awards.
Kung Fu Panda was a great movie – far better than the average kid-oriented animated movie and way better than anyone had any right to expect. But it is so NOT better than Wall-E.
Count me in the camp that really liked Kung Fu Panda as a ‘children’s film’ but appreciate Wall*E for the artistic quality. Maybe like Shawshank Redemption v. No Country for Old Men. And I understand the flack with Wall*E being completely shut out. I can only imagine the buzz among the animation crowd this morning (is there an Awards Daily for animation?).
Since GuyLodge brought up Waltz with Bashir (#5), I was wondering if there’d ever been a film that was eligible for Best Animated film (knowing that the category is young), Best Documentary (though WWB wasn’t eligible this year) and Best Foreign Film?
THERE CAN ONLY BE ONE! Sasha, you sound like Highlander. This is an especially amusing reaction after your comments the other day:
“Much of the Slumdog phenom, by the way, in case you all haven’t noticed, is how surprised and happy they all look when they win. Did you happen to catch the look on Danny Boyle’s face when Slumdog won the SAG? He put his head in his hands, shook his head in shock and amazement. That kind of stuff makes voters feel good about what they’re doing. Just a notion but one that is, I think, semi-worth pursuing as an actual thought.”
Much of the Panda phenom, by the way, in case you haven’t noticed Sasha, is how surprised and happy they all look when they win. That kind of stuff makes voters feel good about what they’re doing. Just a notion but one that is, I think, semi-worth pursuing as an actual thought.
Oh wait — here, we only like ’surprises’ when they are preordained endorsements of films that have already scooped up 30-odd prizes. I prefer Wall-E too, but you’d think someone who had expended so much text on ooshy gooshy surprised happy faces going wide eyed with wonder when they were announced for the umpteenth time would show some appreciation when a legitimate underdog, unawarded throughout the season, wins a clean sweep.
Sasha, everyone that thinks different from you is wrong? You’re not very democratic.
Well, no, but there is a logic to these awards. It should be about, oh, I just “liked” it more. There should be a better way to distinguish “good” from “bad.” This vote is clearly an anti-Wall-E vote. There is no other explanation. And no, I don’t accept when people say “I liked Kung-fu Panda better.” Or “I liked Crash better.” Or “The Dark Knight wasn’t that great.” I don’t accept singular opinions like that and in fact I don’t accept the Annies. One has to, from now on, assume that they don’t give a damn whether a film like Wall-E has broken new ground and that they are, in effect, fairly useless in terms of analyzing the Oscar race. Unless, of course, the entire Academy agrees that Kung-Fu Panda is better than Wall-E. Every year I say this is the last year I’m going to invest so much of my time in the Oscar race. But seriously, if Kung Fu Panda beats Wall-E for Animated Feature (no possible way this happens) I really will seriously contemplate ending my ten year relationship with the Academy. I remember one of my absolute favorite websites, Fennec, quit after the Brokeback debacle. And seriously, if Wall-E were to lose it would be an embarrassment of such epic proportions they might finally prove themselves stunningly pointless. The Dark Knight is one thing, I get it – the batsuit, the voice, etc. But Wall-E? One of the best, if not THE best film of 2008?
The trick is not minding.
Yes, things are stunningly pointless if they do not confirm a single film’s greatness, as attested by everyone else. Only one film is good in a given year: gotcha.
Interesting that no one has shed a tear for Waltz with Bashir yet. Here’s mine.
Settle down, everybody: Wall-E will still win at the Oscars in at least two categories and then we can all go on squashing everything that is not Wall-E in those categories. In the meantime, maybe someone can tentatively recognize that Kung Fu Panda really did have some great animation and impressive voicework, and if it was not recognized here, it wouldn’t be recognized anywhere.
There’s a weirdly totalitarian vibe that comes over these boards in these last few weeks which I find so counter to the spirit of excitement in the nomination round, where all sorts of films have a shot at being recognized.
Stanton has 4 Annies and an Oscar: I’m sure he’ll sleep fine tonight.
WALL E got
BFCA Best Picture NOM
Chicago Film Critics Best Picture WIN
Chicago Film Critics Best Director NOM
LA Film Critics Best Picture WIN
and also besides every awards, Wall E is a revolutionary storytelling in animation and in the history of sci-fic films. It proved that without dialogue by using only visuals a story can be told. That’s what cinema is about…
The critical acclaim for Wall-E has been one of the weirdest things I’ve seen during any Oscar season. I work in the animation industry and while I personally love Wall-E, I hardly know anyone within the community who thinks it’s great. I think a lot of it is Pixar backlash and a lot of it is the whole “First act is great, the rest sucks” mentality that I’ve heard all my co-workers spew out. And then they go on to praise Kung Fu Panda like it revolutionized computer animation, when really it just happened to be the first Dreamworks movie that was worth anything. So it’s no surprise to me that it swept the Annie Awards.
But what I also find interesting is the shear amount of praise Wall-E has gotten from the non-animation community. It seems like it’s gotten more praise than any other Pixar film, which is surprising to me because while Wall-E is great, I think from a story standpoint it isn’t nearly Pixar’s strongest movie. What does this mean for the Oscars? I think Wall-E still has the best chance of winning because the academy is made up of all type of people, not just those from the animation world. But this isn’t the first time a mediocre Dreamworks film has beat a well-received Pixar film, so those who are making money bets on who is going to win on the big night, it might be a smart move to go for the perceived underdog that is Kung Fu Panda.
Wall E is less consistent than Kung Fu Panda. The sequence on earth was brilliant but not so impressive when the film switches to outer space. Is it only me that thought the 2 sections embodied 2 jarringly distinct animation aesthetics?
Kung Fu on the other hand is less ambitious (and more conventional) but ultimately more consistent in its execution so i can understand it winning the award.
Kung Fu Panda is almost boring, come on. Jack Black is only slightly funny and, truth be told, I didn’t think it would be enjoyable to kids when I was watching it. They may be kids, but they do care about a good story with warm family moments and exciting storyline. Okay, maybe I’m putting it a little too sophisticated, point is I was really feeling movies like Lion King and Mulan when I was a child, I would not have felt this movie if I was a child now.
“I work in the animation industry and while I personally love Wall-E, I hardly know anyone within the community who thinks it’s great. I think a lot of it is Pixar backlash and a lot of it is the whole “First act is great, the rest sucks” mentality that I’ve heard all my co-workers spew out. And then they go on to praise Kung Fu Panda like it revolutionized computer animation.”
Chris T, do you work at Dreamworks by chance??? LOL
Ali D.
You see, it’s comments like those that piss me off. They’re just ignorant. Wall-e isn’t original in the fact it used non-talking characters to tell a story. Have you ever seen Richard Williams’ original cut of ‘The Thief and the Cobbler’? The main characters don’t say a word throughout the entire film. And it already gave messages that other sci-fi or kids movies have already said. So, no Wall-e is not ‘revolutionary’. If someone calls it that one more time, my head will explode. Enough is enough.
And I agree with Sam. The ending was so conventional and corny. I love Wall-e. But not his movie.
“And no, I don’t accept when people say “I liked Kung-fu Panda better.” Or “I liked Crash better.” Or “The Dark Knight wasn’t that great.” I don’t accept singular opinions like that and in fact I don’t accept the Annies.”
Wow, that’s all. It seems like you just don’t care about subjectivity.
I thought Wall-E was the worst Pixar film I’ve ever seen.
DISGUSTING….!!!!
Sasha I’m totally with youm this is a travesty….
Sasha,
You pretty much nailed it with your analysis in #28.
Nick K.,
Wall-E is original.
I enjoyed the first half of Wall-E, I was so in love with the second half.
Also, if you check the website for The Annies, DreamWorks is a “gold sponsor” whereas Pixar is just a “silver sponsor”. They have a word for awarding the one that gave you the most money….
WALL-E deserved it, pretty much everyone but the few straggling WALL-E bashers know that. Face it, they did something that no self-respecting animation award would’ve ever done without ulterior motives.
Off topic: Has the Wrestler peaked? Seems it’s not getting PR anywhere.
Don’t worry about it, Sasha.
Nobody gives a damn about the Annies anyway, and if there’s anybody out there who does, this should be enough to convince them that these awards are completely irrelevant.
Wall E was a big bore.. Wall e wall e eva eva, …WTFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF..irritating stuff..and that outer space animations were b grade stuffs.. kung fu panda was more entertaining, good animation and feel good movie
I agree with Sasha. It seems more like a personal attack on Pixar than anything else. I mean I loved Kung Fu Panda just like the next guy but comparing it to Wall-E…well there’s just no comparisons in terms of jaw dropping animation and story telling.
Wow, that’s all. It seems like you just don’t care about subjectivity.
Um, subjectivity is fine when you’re sitting across from your friend in a coffee shop telling them how you felt about a movie. Making history, though, is a whole other thing. Recording that history and looking back on it in ten years is a whole other thing. Awards should be going to the most deserving of the bunch – and I guess to decide that you have to wonder whose “subjective” opinion counts? Why don’t you come up with the best way to do it. Put it to a vote? Well look at how that turned out; clearly Wall-E’s exclusion here is personal. It has to be.
Listen I know almost everyone thinks Wall-E is the best movie of 2008 and the most incredible animated film ever.
But there are equally dedicated animation people who worked on Kung Fu Panda and other animated films in 2008 and lots of people really liked Kung Fu Panda.
Maybe the animation guild felt that Wall-E is so getting the Oscar that they wanted to recognize other people.
Can you blame them?
I was one of those who really liked the Wall-E and Eva characters but who got bored about halfway through the film. But I recognize everyone else’s crazed passion for the film, even if I don’t get it.
A personal attack on Pixar? LOL. Pixar has gotten so many accolades and respect from the film industry and audiences it’s not funny. Can’t other people win awards, too?
As far as KFP being cliched, you could argue that Wall-E is reminiscent of robot films from the past.
I’ve just read through more of the comments above.
Kung Fu Panda is for stupid people? Wow, that’s a smart comment.
I guess Wall-E is the War and Peace of animation.
#32 Chris T. – I think you nailed it. The love for Wall-E is really surprising. I mean, it’s good, but it’s still one of the weakest Pixar movies, in my opinion. Don’t get me wrong, even the weakest Pixar movie (Cars) still is far superior to most of the dreck out there, animated or not.
And a have a little beef to pick: When an awards group votes by secret ballot, I don’t think they are sending a message. Each person is voting for what they think is best. I’d be awfully surprised if each member called up all their colleagues and said, “Let’s send a message and vote against X.” They are just voting for what they believe deserves the win. And unless these groups publish the voting tallies, we’ll never have a good idea whether a “message was being sent.” If Kung Fu Panda won in a landslide, maybe I would suspect some type of Pixar backlash. Maybe Kung Fu Panda won by 1 vote, who knows. When small critics groups pick one film over another, I can buy the argument of a message being sent. However, when it’s a awards group or a guild, I think it’s just what the majority chose. Doesn’t mean one is inferior to the other, it’s just a majority victory.
Finally, I wonder about the voters of these groups, in general. Do you think they obsess over awards like we do? Probably not, although I’m sure there are some who do. Maybe they don’t cling to every pre-cursor award or metacritic score in helping them to decide what to vote for. Naively, I’d like to think the voters watch the nominees and individually pick what they enjoy the best, for whatever personal reason. Just a thought.
I despised “Wall-E” and would not vote for it if I were an Oscar voter.
It was dull, repetitive, and completely uninvolving. The whole ‘chubby’ people thing was completely unoriginal.
I hated it. But…I LOVED KUNG FU PANDA, and cannot wait to see another episode with those funny characters.
“Wall-E” does not deserve any awards, including the Annie.
@ Roger
Your comment is precisely why I value Wall*E over KFP, and, Oh, a much better script, better animation, better directing, better score, better sound..
.. I realize we live in an age where one is required to respect other people’s opinions and choices, but yours is simply put, bad. The fact that you compared KFP to a TV shows where your
(lack of) taste is.
Go back to your Steven Seagel pictures and leave the talking to the grown ups.
OMG THIS CAN’T BE FOR REAL
Wow. Great news for KFP, after all the snubs at every award show finally there’s some people recognize it for its own merits. WALL-E is a boring snorefest, he looks like Jonny 5 and should’ve died, its second half sucks, it’s offensive to fat people, it’s the most overrated and worst Pixar film EVAH!!!
No, I can’t be sarcastic enough. Man, like it or not you can’t deny the fact that WALL-E is one of the best films of the year in general concensus, both with critics and audiences alike, top 10’s, RT scores, LA, Chicago, blah blah blah… KFP is no where near the top, anywhere. Now we’re supposed to believe it’s better than WALL-E, Bashir, and the beautiful $9.99? It’s hardly any better than Bolt, for crying out loud. KFP is good, I can live with it winning something, but totally beat out WALL-E and Bashir? Come on, did it just “happen” that the ASIFA people like it more? I can cry foul and conspiracy, while I refuse to believe the Gold Sponsor has anything to do with the results (who knows if Pixar wasn’t Gold Sponsor sometime?), I still think a total snub is more than suspicious.
- WALL-E was snubbed in music and writing nominations, but later nominated for both Oscars. Don’t even tell me Madagascar 2 has a better screenplay or Despereaux has a better score.
- The KFP ads as “the most celebrated animated film of the year -13 Annie noms” are everywhere. Don’t tell me you’re too naive not to see any politics here. Now they can brag about it.
- The only time Pixar got empty handed was 1999, when Iron Giant won and A Bug’s Life got zero out of 4 noms.
- The second time a Pixar film lost was Monsters, Inc., no, not to Shrek, but to Spirited Away, yet it got one award out of 8 noms. But both ABL and MI never quite got the appreciation WALL-E has gotten this year.
- When Cars won over Happy Feet, there were some backlash leading to the Oscar lost, yet it got two awards out of 9 noms.
- The only time a DWA film won was Shrek, but not over a Pixar film. Now they can really brag about it.
- They give John Lasseter a career award in the year his company’s most critically-acclaimed film gets completely snubbed.
I’m not an animator so I don’t know how hard it is to animate KFP, but is it easy to animate WALL-E or rotoscope Bashir? Heh. When some animated film is hailed as “transcend the genre”, then the common sense is to recognize it in any form in your own society, but nah, they passed. Maybe they have their reasons, maybe it’s just happened, but it’s a missed chance and yeah, something will go into history if anyone cares about these kinds of awards.
- If you say WALL-E isn’t revolutionary then tell me how KFP is.
- If you say WALL-E is boring then tell me how Curse of the Were-rabbit were more fun than Madagascar.
- If you say WALL-E makes less money thus less people actually enjoy it, then tell me what’s with Spirited Away and Iron Giant.
- If you say WALL-E has a weak ending compare to its first half, then tell me how consistent mediocrity wins over poetic brilliance.
- If you say WALL-E’s first half isn’t brilliant, then tell me how any minute KFP is.
- If you say WALL-E is full of cliché and trite, then tell me how on earth KFP is any better.
- If you say WALL-E, or Bashir, or $9.99, or even Bolt, is worse than KFP, please enlighten me.
…
Last words, enough ranting, WALL-E is the biggest loser at the Annies, but it’s over. Yeah, maybe KFP is the best and all that, and the ASIFA rocks too.
This is one of the stupidest things I’ve ever heard. Kung Fu Panda was great, but it’s not even in the same league as Wall-E. Idiots.
Seriously, Sasha, I love Wall·E but I can see why they picked Panda instead. Panda hasn’t a couple of deep problems Wall·E do have, and while despite of these issues Wall·E becomes a masterpiece which Panda isn’t, Panda doesn’t have any real issue and it is, on another way, another memorable film.
I agree with the first post–I enjoyed Kung Fu Panda on so many more levels than I did WALL*E. I definitely wasn’t blown away by the latter. I didn’t find it all that unique, either. Sure, KFP had cliches, but so did WALL*E, quite frankly. As I keep saying, the first act of the film on the planet was excellent, but the rest I thought was just “meh”. I also felt that the “green” message was so pedantically conveyed. Considering it was from the same man who brought us Finding Nemo, which I think is the best of all the Pixar films, I was actually quite disappointed. KFP was captivating, WALL*E was only partially so. I think KFP deserves all its kudos from the Annies, and I would have like to see it receive some Oscar nods, as well, especially for score and art direction. I think the love for WALL*E is hyperbole, at best. It’s the same way I feel about TDK, too. One day I’m going to have to watch Ironman with sound so I’ll be able to compare the two.
by the way, I spoke to my Indian friend–who’s from Bombay–about Slumdog, and he says he refuses to see it because it diverges way too much from the book in key parts and because it’s made from a British colonialist perspective. He also said it hasn’t been well-received in India despite the press that says otherwise. I still liked the movie, though.
Roger: “The whole ‘chubby’ people thing was completely unoriginal.”
…and the chubby Panda thing was?
Anyone feeling like Kung Fu Panda is the better film or that this really even makes a dent in WALL-E’s epic amount of awards should see this. I’ve *only* included Best Picture wins and #1’s on important lists, which cuts it down considerably from the hundreds who have it at #2 or just aren’t as “big” as these lists. I included one nomination because it hasn’t been announced yet, but did not include the Best Picture nominations that it lost, although being nominated for them is already new ground for the world of animation. The point is, Kung Fu Panda can’t claim to have won any “Best Picture” awards, just The Annie’s questionable awards that nobody will be taking seriously anymore. Here’s the list:
Time Magazine – http://www.time.com/time/specials/2008/top10/article/0,30583,1855948_1863826_1863827,00.html#
Los Angeles Film Critics Association – http://www.variety.com/VR1117997085.html
Boston Critics – (Tie) http://www.incontention.com/?p=3469
Toronto Critics – (Runner Up) – http://www.awardsdaily.com/?p=4957
The Onion A.V. Club – http://www.avclub.com/content/feature/the_year_in_film_2008
Chicago Film Critics Association – http://www.chicagofilmcritics.org/
Lond Film Critics Awards – (Nomination for Best Pic, Not Yet Announced) – http://www.altfg.com/blog/awards/london-film-critics-awards-2009/
Online Film Critics Society – http://www.awardsdaily.com/?p=6103
The Golden Tomatoes – http://www.rottentomatoes.com/guides/rtawards/wide/
This is actually very easily explained.
Anyone can vote for the Annies. In order to vote for the Annies, you merely have to buy a membership to the organization (ASIFA). In other words, they sell ballots.
It’s well known that the Annie Awards are a complete joke. Nobody in animation takes them seriously and I’m always surprised how widely they are reported in the industry. This was a simple case of Dreamworks literally buying more ballots than Pixar this year.
Now I definitely have a bad feeling about WALL-E’s Oscar chances. After the TDK debacle, I’ve come to realize that big precursors (BAFTA’s and Globes) will ALWAYS have more precedence than critics and audiences.
I’m curious as to what people liked about Wall-E. I walked out of the theater scratching my head over all the hype that this movie received.
The animation wasn’t groundbreaking, the robot was a direct rip-off of “Short Circuit”, there was little dialogue in the movie, the love story element just didn’t work, and the “green” message was too subtle to have any impact.
I saw Wall-E as a movie that failed to deliver to youngsters (over their heads) as well as adults (too slow, ponderous, unimaginative). In other words, who is the target audience for this movie? It’s easily Pixar’s worst movie, and for all you “The Dark Knight deserves to win everything because it made a bazillion dollars argument”, Wall-E didn’t perform as well at the boxoffice as most of Pixar’s other films, either.
As for boxoffice, Wall-E edges out Kung Fu Panda by about $10 million domestically, but loses out to Kung Fu Panda by about $100 million world-wide. It looks like KFP is a more universally loved film.
I still think Wall-E will win the Oscar for best animated film, because the Academy loves Pixar, but I’ll be happier if it goes to Kung Fu Panda.
Dreamworks happens to be a major sponsor of this event. These awards were bought and sold. Case closed. That said, I think they definitely got some major penis envy going on. Having said that, I’m so fucking ready for Up!
And having said all that, I think Kung Fu Panda was a very nice movie.
You want unequivocable proof that this was all fixed? They didn’t even award the Short category to Presto! in favor of a mediocre Wallace & Gromit short produced by…….Dreamworks.
Oh, and Sasha, I’d say its not one of the weirdest years, but it may be one of the worst. So much letdown this year. I know, I know, “The trick is not minding.” But when the disappointment comes down the pike OVER and OVER again you just can’t help it. When is it all gonna stop? When Frost/Nixon wins Best Picture? When Best Actress goes to Angelina Jolie?
To those who say they enjoy KFP more than WALL-E, so it’s more worthy: yes, I enjoy it greatly, but you “enjoy” it so it’s the best? This is not the People’s Choice (and even at the People’s Choice WALL-E won), they (supposedly) have to award the best achievements in their field. And it’s not KFP vs. WALL-E. How about Bashir? $9.99? And Bolt? Do you enjoy them or what? Or they’re just worse than KFP because people don’t enjoy them? Not many people enjoyed Wallace and Gromit: Curse of the Were-rabbit, it was bombed at the BO, but wasn’t it worthy of praise?
And if judged by BO numbers, wow, don’t even go there.
If they (assuming those people are real people and not companies buying ballots) think KFP is the best then so be it, but the “enjoy” comments are laughable.
@ Chris Price: don’t let your bias blind you. the W&G short has nothing to do with DWA, it’s quite a nice short. I don’t believe they are fixed or bought, just an epic fail.
RJGinCA:
“Animation wasn’t groundbreaking.” Really? So dancing in space, a world covered in garbage, the sheer grandiosity of the Axiom, EVE’s sleek design, did nothing for you?
“The robot was a direct rip-off of “Short Circuit”" I see the vague similarity, but the same could be said about COUNTLESS of other leading characters in other movies. Is the story the same as Short Circuit? Are there even other similar characters?
“Little dialogue in the movie.” City Lights and The Gold Rush. Need I say more?
“Green message was too subtle to have an impact.” You know, I bet you’d still be complaining even if they made the “green” messag obvious and over the top. And besides, were the filmmakers looking to make an impact? Was it there aim to get the US to ratify Kyoto?
“The love story element just didn’t work.” An opinion of course, but I daresay that the fact that the robots conveyed more emotion than half of the acting nominees this year (ahemBradPittahem) makes me beg to differ.
“The Dark Knight deserves to win everything because it made a bazillion dollars argument” I hate when people bring this up. People weren’t lobbying for these movies to get Oscar nods because of their box office. For that matter, where was the Oscar push for POTC: Dead Man’s Chest, all the Harry Potters, Phantom Menace? WALL-E and TDK had the support of three groups that should have made them shoo-ins for BP: general audiences, critics, and the film industry.
So yes, Sasha, this is a very weird year.
RJGinCA wins the award for comment that least directly applies to the film at hand. Wow. A message is subtle? There’s little dialogue? When did that become synonymous with badness?
***An opinion of course, but I daresay that the fact that the robots conveyed more emotion than half of the acting nominees this year (ahemBradPittahem) makes me beg to differ.***
The very nature of Pitt’s character in “Button” is a man detached from the world, and thus detached from his emotions. It was perfectly fitting, and Pitt did a beautiful job. You might as well mention Richard Jenkins, because that man showed the absolute least amount of emotion in “The Visitor.” And such was his character as well.
“No, but the Annies are animation peers – this is a disgusting slap in the face to Wall-E and Pixar.”
Exactly the point….this could be a very political decision…John Lasseter is the head of pixar and well known to be a prick to work for within the animation community.
This really doesn’t surprise me at all…
Okay, I’m a big Wall*E supporter, but you guys have GOT TO BE KIDDING ME with this “DreamWorks is a gold sponsor; Pixar is a silver sponsor – DreamWorks bought every award” CRAP.
Pixar has won many, many Annies before. DreamWorks hasn’t taken home a Best Animated Feature Annie since 2002 (not counting Wallace & Gromit, which was really an Aardman Production).
So everyone STOP IT with the “so and so are buying these awards.”
And same thing with these political arguments. Again, Pixar has won MANY, MANY Annie Awards in the past.
So…are you guys telling me that DreamWorks (Gold Sponsor) bought the Best Animated Feature Annie (and 8 others) for Pixar last year for Ratatouille?!
The non stop cheerleading for TDK and Wall-E at AD has become tiresome. So what if Kung Fu Panda won awards and Wall-E didn’t. Forrest Gump also beat Shawshank for BP and the world didn’t come to an end.Did anyone stop to think that people are tired of being hit over the head about how great TDK and Wall-E are? Not everyone thinks these films are that great. Perhaps these snubs are a response to the non stop cheerleading.
“John Lasseter is the head of pixar and well known to be a prick to work for within the animation community.”
Yet they awarded him a career award? Yet Venice Film Festival honors him and his Pixar directors? lol.
“Perhaps these snubs are a response to the non stop cheerleading.”
What a mature way of response. What are they, a bunch of emo teenages or what? lol.
The non stop cheerleading for TDK and Wall-E at AD has become tiresome. So what if Kung Fu Panda won awards and Wall-E didn’t. Forrest Gump also beat Shawshank for BP and the world didn’t come to an end.Did anyone stop to think that people are tired of being hit over the head about how great TDK and Wall-E are? Not everyone thinks these films are that great. Perhaps these snubs are a response to the non stop cheerleading.
Only if they come to this site, which they clearly don’t. If those are their response to the non-stop cheerleading, well guess what? They shouldn’t be in the ENTERTAINMENT business because guess what else? We’re the ones putting out our cold hard cash to pay to see the movies they put out. And they don’t care what we think? Uh, beg to differ. And if this is “tiresome,” please go elsewhere. Cause it’s only going to get worse, honey. In fact, your constant complaining only makes me want to drive the nail in deeper. Yes, Dark Knight and Wall-E were the two best films of the year. Deal with it.
I heart Sasha.
Sasha, i’ve been visiting AD since 2006 and I like it very much. Is ok to be pasionate about a film in particular but I think this attitude doesn’t make the site look good because you look more like a fangirl and not like a serious writer or blogger. We respect your opinions but you are taking a defensive position with your readers.
Yes, it’s getting tiresome, but you should be thankful that we are still faithful to your site.
I hope you can take a constructive critizism.
Sorry if my english is poor.
Okay, Kung Fu Panda was DreamWorks Animation’s best movie in ages, but better than WALL-E? No fucking way.
And to completely shut out WALL-E? That’s just fucking ridiculous and frankly embarrassing. Say goodbye to your credibility, Annie Awards.
Seriously, is everyone in Hollywood using crack these days? The Reader getting a Best Picture nomination over The Dark Knight? WALL-E getting shut out at the Annie Awards? What the fuck is going on? Don’t do drugs when you’re voting for awards!
Anyway, yeah, this is definitely a case of Pixar envy. All those fucking animators who don’t work at Pixar are just jealous, because Pixar is the best there is (outside of Studio Ghibli) and because Pixar wins all the awards and gets all the acclaim and makes more money than them. It’s just fucking pathetic. What a bunch of fucking losers!
Hans: I’ve come to realize that big precursors (BAFTA’s and Globes) will ALWAYS have more precedence than critics and audiences.
Youve nailed the Slumdog phenomenon on the head because it has it all…
About the Annies- Ive never heard of them, do they really matter that much anyway?? I have a problem with saying theyve lost credibility because you dont agree with their choices. Awards are NOT scientific nor solely based on merit- it is idealistic to think they are or can become so
And they don’t owe us anything. This awards are from the industry to the industry. We don’t have nothing to do there.
Hmm, just yesterday I posted on the Predict The Oscars page that I could see the Panda stealing the Animated Oscar from Wall-E and now this
Look, first of all, the level of vitriol of this website when a perceived favourite film gets snubbed is ridiculous. It’s like there are only ever two films in each category – your favourite, and every other, and if the other wins, you are personally insulted!
And then, to Wall-E. The point I made on that other page was simple: Wall-E’s merits are on a high level, a level we true film-lovers can see and appreciate, but that most others cannot. And those people who don’t “get” the merits are actually often in the industry, they are Oscar voters, and now Annie voters as well. Just because you make movies, it doesn’t mean that you will want to champion a movie like Wall-E over a more broad film like Kung Fu Panda.
Kung Fu Panda is easy to digest, it’s hilarious, and it features a surprising number of A-List Hollywood stars who can promote it. Wall-E is masterful, but not to the average Joe.
Kung Fu Panda is going to win the Oscar as well. But honestly, why is this so upsetting? The list of truly master film that missed the Oscars is more telling about the award than the mediocre films that have won. Why can you guys all see so clearly into the heart of a film, but not see clearly that the award bodies don’t and will never think like you?
The Annies were clearly, CLEARLY bought by Dreamworks. No question about it. All of the big winners are from Dreamworks. This is some sick joke. The Annies should be absolutely ashamed of themselves.
I hope that Stanton and Pixar completely ignore this cheap, spiteful, paid for slap-in-the-face, and continue making the Best. Animated Films. Ever.
Dear Sasha…I am too afraid of you to leave my actual opinion…..he he
Wow. so because they awarded a film other than your favourite, they were bought? Honestly, sometimes it seems like when you post to this website, you are instantly mailed out a pair of AwardsDaily Blinders, and somehow mine just got lost at customs…
And a note to Sasha: I realize that this website is your baby, and that you are just as passionate about movies as the rest, but as the keeper of the site, you need (IMO) to stay a little more above the fray). Let others rip dissenters to shreds over films like TDK and Wall-E, but you mustn’t! What you will do is create a personality-driven website consisting only of your devoted followers, in stead of the awesome site it has generally been. Honestly, over the last few weeks, this website has been very aggressive against anyone, like myself, who happen to disagree that Wall-E and TDK are that good. That’s blind mob mentality, and I used to think your site was above that.
Thanks,
Tim
Folks, we’re not suggesting that the Annie Awards were bought. It’s no secret conspiracy. It is a fact. Allow me to repeat:
ANYONE CAN VOTE FOR THE ANNIE AWARDS BY SIMPLY PURCHASING A BALLOT FROM THEM.
Go to the ASIFA/Annie Awards website and see for yourself. The whole organization is a sham and these awards should NOT be viewed as other guild or industry awards. ALL of the major animation studios BUY AS MANY BALLOTS as they possibly can each year to sway the Annie results. Everyone in the animation industry is aware of this. This year, Dreamworks apparently bought more.
So please stop viewing the Annie Awards as anything more than a publicity stunt!! It has absolutely no bearing on anything and is not worth reporting on.
No, I don’t think they are bought, or else Pixar had to buy a whole lot of awards over the years. I truly believe the majority of votes were for KFP. That’s how massive fail on an epic proportion they were.
It’s not that the Pixar loonies are constantly crazy and obsessed. No one ever cried foul when Spirited Away won over Monsters, Inc. or Wallace & Gromit won over Corpse Bride, or even Shrek, because they’re the best of the year, and not only the Annies acknowledged that but so many others. Cars/Happy Feet was a fair race, when one won some, the other won others.
Now what has KFP won prior to this? NOTHING. Are they all blinded by Pixar to not give KFP what it deserves so long, if it’s truly the best of the year? What about Bashir other snubs? They’re so out of general consensus and common sense that it’s ridiculous. And we’re supposed to believe these out of the blue wins are legit?
That’s their rights, their money and their votes to pick their “best film.” It’s our nobodies’ rights to question their credibility, make up conspiracy theories, cry foul and boycott, because what else can we do? lol.
Tim, give it a rest. It´s okay to have a personal opinion. I´m not a fan of The Dark Knight but I can understand that the majority is and I do not have any problem with it. That said I was not that suprised that it didn´t get oscarnominated as best picture becuase it isn´t usual oscarfare and I think the fans of this movie should be quite happy with the nominations it got (quite many after all).
The case with Annie and Wall-E though is another matter. Here we have a case with an organization that only honor animated movies and in this particular field it is absolutely clear that Wall-E is the best of the year. We have different personal opinons but it´s a fact that Wall-E is (far and above) the most accomplished animated movie of the year (and among the most accomplished of any genre this year really) so for the Annie to completely shut it out and to shower Kung fu Panda with awards is nothing but a scandal. The biggest loser though is Annie, they clearly will lose the very little credibility they had.
For the record I will state that my personal opinion is that Wall-E is not among Pixar´s very best but it is still quite an accomplishment and is far better than Kung fu Panda. It is like comparing The Godfather to What´s up Doc.
Tim, if you’ve been following this site for as many years you’ll recognize this as not anything new. The difference is that Ryan isn’t here to be in the fray so I’m in it. And the only thing that has really changed in all of these years is the movies being represented. I have always taken heat from readers for exactly what you express here. As I have to say every year, I’m not a corporation where good customer service matters — I like providing stuff readers find enjoyable. That’s great – but you are invited, as always, to leave it. It just is what it is.
Damo, go ahead. I won’t rip your head off. In fact, if you’d all prefer it, I won’t even comment at all. I’m perfectly happy ignoring the comments and going about my daily routine. I wouldn’t do this gig if I wasn’t passionate about the race and about the films involved. You can’t have one without the other — passion goes in both directions.
Kung Fu Panda is going to win the Oscar as well. But honestly, why is this so upsetting? The list of truly master film that missed the Oscars is more telling about the award than the mediocre films that have won. Why can you guys all see so clearly into the heart of a film, but not see clearly that the award bodies don’t and will never think like you?
Tim, all due respect, but I’d like to know exactly who really does vote for the Annies. Also, do you really think the Academy would have broken the record for an animated film in as many categories, including screenplay, if they didn’t love Wall-E? Seriously?
Sasha, you should change you’re post with passionate about the race and SOME of the films involved.
I´d like to say to the person who said Kung fu Panda would win the oscar:
Sorry the academy ain´t that stupid. We can complain all we want that they make the wrong choises from time to time but they would never make such an epic fail as the Annie has managed this year. Wall-E is a lock for the oscarwin.
Sasha, I love the love for certain films, I just hate the attacks against those who disagree. And as for the multiple Oscar noms for Wall-E, it is the clear favourite, there’s no way around it, and it very likely will win. But, in crazy times (trashed economy, bad news about it every day, job losses) who is to say that the easy films with broad laughs like KFP might not surprise? Does a darker (ultimately hopeful, but still, darker) films like Wall-E maybe suffer from a rough time in the world? We’ll see, but I think people have declared this a lock WAY too soon, same with Ledger. Not Slumdog though. There’s no way it isn’t going to win BP.
Cheers!
“Kung Fu Panda is going to win the Oscar as well. But honestly, why is this so upsetting?”
They gave it 6 nominations and then give KFP – with just a single nom – the statue of best animated film? If that’s not upsetting I don’t know what is.
If it’s the case then I guess KFP really is the best after all. Heh.
This is a related but somewhat tangential point: anyone else intrigued by the fact that one of the surest ways to nab a screenplay nomination seems to be to write or conceive a Pixar film? This is not to knock Wall-E, but its success in best screenplay puts it in a long tradition going back to Toy Story. (Shrek also got one of those nominations, albeit not as a Pixar film but perhaps the more quality animated feature of that year.)
Also, Sasha, as has been said earlier, Wall-E tied the record with Beauty: it didn’t break it.
Shrek was an adapted screenplay, and quite a clever one, so it got nom.
While 6 noms tied WALL-E with Beauty and the Beast, it got into more categories though (6 vs. 4) but Beauty had Best Picture nom, and likely holds that record forever.
Toy Story 2, A Bug’s Life, Monsters, Inc. and Cars didn’t get nom for original screenplay. I’d say it’s not always the case (it’s Pixar!!! better nominate it!!!), when it’s good it’s nominated. But it’s true that Pixar films are the only animated films get original screenplay noms.
Yet they SNUBBED the Oscar nominated screenplay at the Annies. Hah!
Yes JD. THAT is a disgrace, that and the snub of Thomas Newman score for Wall-E (which also is oscarnominated by the way).
They nominated the screenplay for the likes of Madagascar 2 over Wall-E!!! Annie an award to be taken seriously? Doesn´t look like it to me.
Sasha,
Even though we disagree on our favorite movies of the year, I think you have an incredible website, and I personally would like to thank you for the time and effort you take to put together the Awards news and information as it comes out, as well as a forum for us to discuss, and yes, frequently disagree. I haven’t read any blogs (yet) that have thanked you for the service you perform by having this website, so, even though I doubt I’m the first, I want to say thank you.
I have faithfully jumped on your website for years (and years–long before the name change), and if it wasn’t for just recently joining in “the fray” of your blogs, I would never have thought you had an opinion–let alone a biased one. I mean this as a compliment, because I think you’ve done an excellent job covering all the nominees, including the ones you may feel are “less worthy”, such as Slumdog or The Reader. It really isn’t until we get to the blogs, where the intensity of your favoritism toward certain films show.
But, I think, for the vast part, when it comes to communicating awards information, your website posts are objective, up-to-date, comprehensive, and pretty much non-biased. Whether you want that to change or not is up to you–after all it’s your website. However, I agree with other bloggers who feel that taking the high road, and remaining as neutral and impartial as possible might prevent alienating certain people from your site. However, I like your website whatever your opinion is, and am grateful that you allow us to discuss our feelings–agree or disagree.
I can certainly understand the passion people have for certain films. I’m a huge Lord of the Rings fan, and was amazed how the first film (Fellowship of the Ring) lost out on the big prize (along with 6 others), after receiving 13 Academy Award nominations.
But, I think we all have to acknowledge that the Academy is not a group of fanboys/girls, film critics, or even the general public. It is a society of people who are exclusively in the motion picture industry, and the fact that we’re invited each year to peek inside their Awards show is a privilege and an honor–not an opportunity to spew venom and derision over their choices.
For example, I saw the Reader and actually liked it. It moved me emotionally (I got choked up a few times during the movie), and it deals with (adult) subject matter such as the Holocaust, pedastery, illiteracy, coming of age, and dealing with the impact of your decisions over a lifetime of agony and possible regret. Was it as fun to watch as TDK? No, but I can understand why the Academy put it in its Top 5. I guessed they liked the “message”, along with terrific acting. And it never hurts a movie’s chances of Oscar success, if it deals with the Holocaust. That’s what Oscar history has shown.
Yes, many times the Academy will think with their hearts and not their heads, which is what makes guessing which films are going to win and which films are going to lose so much fun. But I think if the Academy is going to err it’s going to be on the side of “highbrow”. Take for example, Chariots of Fire, The Last Emperor, Gandhi, The English Patient, and yes A Beautiful Mind (over LOTR: FOTR).
That’s why, even though I found Wall-E a total bore, I think it will win the Oscar. It’s the animated film that wasn’t really meant for kids. In other words, it’ the “highbrow” choice, whilst Kung Fu Panda is the popcorn for the kiddies.
“…and the fact that we’re invited each year to peek inside their Awards show is a privilege and an honor…”
Total BS but oh so true. It’s us who get crazy about them, as if they even care. They know it and that’s why they’ve been worshiping themselves out of their ***.
Awards are always subjective BS. But this year’s Annie is the biggest BS ever. I’d rather feel for KFP.
Rob Y.
Watch ‘Short Circuit’ and ‘The Thief and the Cobbler*’ or any other animated kids movie that has environmental morals in it if you haven’t already. Then we’ll talk about originality. Oh, and don’t forget 2001:A space Oddyssey. That’s a big one. And Mike Judge’s Idiocracy. Oh, and this is a book, but the book ‘Feed’ is a great satire on Consumerism and material goods.
*Watch the Recobbled edit, not the dreadful Miramax cut.
I enjoyed Kung Fu Panda more than Wall-E as well. The reason Panda might seem cliche is because it is, among many things, a spoof of the martial arts genre. Its making LIGHT of the cliches from those films. Just because it’s a spoof doesn’t mean it’s not a quality film.
Wall-E was too antiseptic for my taste, and I similarly don’t understand the hype. It is not really a spoof, but it does, I think, borrow liberally from other sci fi texts. As far as Pixar’s concerned, I thought Finding Nemo, The Incredibles and Ratatouille were all better. All of those found more emotional resonance with me.
Am I the only person here who thinks that Wall-E is “half-baked” (for lack of a better term)? I believe that the first half of the movie was a MASTERPIECE, no doubt about it… but the second half (the minute Wall-E left earth) was just “okay” and somewhat preachy for my taste. If I’m just being honest, I like Monster’s Inc. better than Wall-E (let the debate begin!), thoroughly enjoyable from start to end.
I have already watched both animated movies (Kung Fu Panda and Wall-E) and for some strange reason, I enjoyed the Panda more than the robot.
Yes, it might be true that Wall-E broke new ground because it paid homage to the silent movies and executed it REALLY WELL…. but that’s about it. If Wall-E was only 40 mins long… i would have voted for it over Kung Fu Panda.
Sasha seems to have gone over the edge because of a little cliche animated love story, regardless of how good it was, and it was pretty good; a little dry. Golly jeepers, take a nutural opinion as the host, and not degrade the visitors of your site for their worthwhile opinions.
Panda seems to have struck a significant cord with many people, so just accept and acknowledge it. Tomorrow morning none of your ranting will matter.
Please do not remove my opinion just because you don’t agree, Sasha.
Thanks.
wow, i can’t believe this subject broke over 100 comments. both Wall-E and Kung Fu Panda rocked, but you can’t compare them.
what confuses me is the 3rd nominee, Bolt. Would’ve gone with Horton over that one.
guess we need something new to bitch about now that the Dark Knight and Iron Man debate is old, lol.
Wow, folks stop jumping down Sasha’s throat. You all are allowed to love a movie and parade it in the comments section and she isn’t? Its so much more relevant when you know where the editor stands and is coming from rather than vague ambiguous articles. She is stating what is a fact, not an opinion, that Wall-E & TDK are the 2 most celebrated films in popular & critical parlance combined.
I find the overall disappointment over Wall-E’s loss to Kung Fu Panda to be perfectly understandable, but rather confusing on another level. Wall-E is evidently a great film while Kung Fu Panda is a good film. However, Waltz with Bashir is, in my opinion, this year’s best animated film by far (and close to a masterpiece) and I am much more disappointing in its lack of awards recognition at the Annies, especially Max Richter’s loss in score (how is that even possible?). It’s just my opinion though.
Has anybody here even seen Bashir?
If not, that may explain its curious absence from these comments.
Hey Red_Wine, Please check out Sasha’s comment before telling us to back down. As an editor, her opinions are not balanced, and not respectful of other opinions. They are strigent (not just patient) and inciteful. I myself preferred WALL-E to Panda, but that is my opinion, and I know my opinion is my own, not to be forced on others. I’m not so pompus to think my opinion really matters. What Sasha states is not a “fact”.
- “One movie is simply better than the other. Kung Fu Panda is one cliche after another. It
notenoughtime, this site isn’t a government institution, & Sasha is not running for office that she has to be all PC & please everyone. She’s stating her opinion just like you & me. You can say whatever you want & have your opinion, nobody’s stopping you. This is all a constructive discussion, not an exercise to trump one another. What’s the fun if in a personal website or blog, the personality of the person behind it doesn’t shine through.
Please do not remove my opinion just because you don’t agree, Sasha.
Your comment gets removed if you are an asshole and make personal insults or attacks. “Struck a significant cord”? Uh, I don’t think so. Maybe you. And maybe two of your friends.
Wall-E was too antiseptic for my taste, and I similarly don’t understand the hype.
Again, just because you didn’t understand it doesn’t mean it wasn’t warranted. What is weird to me is how this group, the Annies, makes such a bad call (history will prove this to be true, despite the momentary support from the commenters here) and all of these Wall-E haters come out of the wood work. The Los Angeles Film Critics named Wall-E the best film of 2008. Are to discount them and say, oh, but the Annies had it going on. You know, I’m just not going to buy it. I think it invalidates them and removes what credibility they had. Sorry, but that’s how I see it.
Well said Red-wine, I couldn’t agree more. So stop with the “folks stop jumping down Sasha’s throat”. That seems to be in contrast with your “You can say whatever you want…” remark from the last posting.
Regardless, there is no absolutes to this little discussion. People like WALLE and people like Panda, it’s silly for someone to say absolutely one is better than the other, and a little pompous.
Hey Red_Wine, Please check out Sasha’s comment before telling us to back down. As an editor, her opinions are not balanced, and not respectful of other opinions.
You are beating a dead horse here. Your opinions are valid but your direct insults are not going to be tolerated. I only respect the opinions of people I respect, if that makes sense. Anyone who says “Wall-E sucked” or “The Dark Knight sucked” is probably ever going to get my respect. Can they post that shit here? Sure they can. But don’t expect I won’t argue it.
This is absolutely a case of industry folk engaging in spite-voting because they are jealous of the studio that consistently produces the finest animated films.
Actually, I’m surprised it took this long for the Annies to throw a tantrum like this. Pixar has been shaming everyone else with their excellence for over a decade now.
On the plus side: Hooray for The Beast with a Billion Backs!!
You really should seperate yourself from movie opinions. I don’t see how someone saying “Wall-E sucked” is a direct insult against Sasha Stone. Please explain.
Sorry if this is to direct, trying to not come off as, how did you say it Sasha, an “asshole”. And please don’t go out of your way to be personally offended, it is not my goal.
@ Gentle Benj
Oh yeah. Cool for Futurama. Those buttheads at Fox (sorry, Box) better not pull the plug on it again.
Now if Wall-e was about a drunk and vulgar robot who wanted to love, THAT would be something. Oh well, Bender will have his very own movie one day. Same with Zoidberg.
notenoughtime(you sure have a lot of time), if you disagree with something, attack the opinion, not the person. Why would you get personal? We are anonymous here. Carry out out the discussion on the basis of what they have said, not their personality. And because the Annies are expected to award good animation, they could atleast be expected to see triumphant animation in Wall-E.
And honestly it seems rather trivial & banal, that a film that has been sparking best of the year debate, won many critics best picture awards & is over-all the most critically celebrated film of the year gets compared to Kung-Fu Panda.
Regardless, there is no absolutes to this little discussion. People like WALLE and people like Panda, it’s silly for someone to say absolutely one is better than the other, and a little pompous.
I disagree. I think you can say one is better than the other provided it doesn’t start with “I liked this one better.” Because I think liking and acknowledging greatness are two different things. I didn’t “like” There Will Be Blood but I can acknowledge its greatness.
“I think liking and acknowledging greatness are two different things.”
Thats absolutely true, there are many great films which you don’t necessarily love and watch them again & again but you can admire their scope & vision & ambition. For me such a film would be Blade Runner, it is hailed as a towering classic, and I can see why, but I still don’t love it.
Sasha, I agree with that last sentance. It was balanced, and respectful of others potential opinions. Bravo.
I think Wall-E is so, so overrated. It raised the most important and real issues of our time: our self-indulgence and destruction of the natural environment, but it fails to address any of them. A robot that continues to do something that is a complete waste of time (stacking, collecting and re-stacking rubbish), fat idiots returning to earth with eyes wide open (not sure why because their current existence suits them so much) and a climax that is built on one, impractical plant. The most inconclusive ending, possibly, ever.
So, of course, it will win the Oscar.
#32: “a lot of it is the whole “First act is great, the rest sucks” mentality that I’ve heard all my co-workers spew out.”
Odd, I’ve always felt the same way about The Lion King — or at least that the movie was 90% first act and/or the projectionist at my theatre forgot to play a whole reel….
This surprising award made me wonder just how much weight is put on the technical aspects of the animation alongside the story, voice acting, etc. I could almost imagine a film with superior visuals but lackluster story going up against a film with a great script but only “pretty good” visuals. Which is the better film? And, which is the better ANIMATED film?
A few things.
1. Of course the ending of Wall-E is open-ended, but what else could it be? If mankind floated on an outer-space pleasure cruiser for generations, being only taught what a machine felt they needed to keep them happy, of COURSE they would arrive back on Earth and have no idea of what to do.
2. A film *about* a problem doesn’t have to provide a solution *to* it to have merit. Films about racism or homophobia or the Holocaust have power in though they don’t offer up any kind of summary treatise. I think Wall-E shows a ravaged Earth in a way that no other film has quite captured.
Thanks,
Tim
#82:
“Wall-E’s merits are on a high level, a level we true film-lovers can see and appreciate, but that most others cannot. And those people who don’t “get” the merits are actually often in the industry, they are Oscar voters, and now Annie voters as well. Just because you make movies, it doesn’t mean that you will want to champion a movie like Wall-E over a more broad film like Kung Fu Panda.”
I recall people saying this was the same reason Julianne Moore lost to Nicole Kidman: many of the people in the industry didn’t appreciate what _Far from Heaven_ was doing with the genre of 50s melodrama. Instead, they read the film as simply being derivative. In not getting the film, they didn’t get Moore’s performance, and gave the award to Kidman in a performance where the transformation (nose, voice, hair, etc.) was easier for voters to see.
Kung-Fu Panda beat Wall-E?
That is the most disgusting news I’ve ever read on Awardsdaily.com
I’m horrified.
@ Nick K.
WOOP woop woop woop woop!!!
“Same with Zoidberg.”
At least Zoidberg got a shout-out in the recent Superman/Legion storyline in Action Comics!
Usually you can’t argue with taste, but this is one instance that you can just say: “You’re wrong.” People won’t be doubting WALL-E with this, people will be doubting, and ridiculing the Annies. Just a question: What’s the voting body for the Animated Feature Oscar? If the same happens there, that’d be an issue far more worthy of controversy than the TDK, Springsteen, Gomorra and Hawkins snubs combined.
Just a quick note: way back on one of my posts above there is the line “Kung Fu Panda will win the Oscar, too”. That honestly should have read “Kung Fu Panda might just win the Oscar, too.” I’ve stated above that Wall-E is the clear front-runner, I just don’t see the animated category as locked up as most others, despite the multiple noms.
And to the handful who mentioned that the Annies will lose credibility over the KFP sweep, if they are trying to be known as a group that awards art then you are absolutely right. KFP = entertainment. Wall-E = art.
But honestly, who are they? ARE they generally a critical group? I must say I have no idea.
To #121: I personally saw the issues about the state of Earth during Wall-E to be a tool to add to the main plot–help it move, give purpose, etc. But it was not the main message–I saw the love story to be that instead. I watched the Wall-E director commentary and heard something similar during Stanton’s commentary. The people destroying Earth and returning was presented in an almost-secondary fashion.
Maybe the cartoon guild was bought by Jeffzenberg who just made this worthless animation division to spite Disney. Every thing that comes out of Dreamworks Animation is just trash! Yep, including “Shrek” Notice that unlike Pixar, who just made one sequel to its feature films, Dreamworks has total lack of creativity and originality and just possess plain greed and a desire to fatten up its bottomline by doing sequels over and over again – Shrek 2, 3, – 1,000 perhaps, A Kung Fu Panda sequel in the works, and just plain stupid cartoons like A Shark’s Tale! And now it has been copying the style and design of Pixar through its upcoming moving Alienvs Vs. Monsters which visually & stylistically looks like a cross between The Incredibles and Monsters Inc! Shame on you Katzenberg! Bwahahahaha!!!
I think Monsters vs. Aliens looks hilarious, as does my 5-year old
To be honest, I love both “WALL-E” and “Kung Fu Panda”, and with Pixar winning so many times previously at the Annies, I guess it felt like for the members over there it was time for Pixar to step down and let one of it’s competiters take the prizes. Both have their own great tastes: “WALL-E” has a wonderful post-apocalyptic / eco-friendly realisim setting and “Kung Fu Panda” has it’s own appealing cartoony style.
The other winners I found good too. Wallace and Gromit made little surprise with winning the short subject award with their “Matter of Loaf and Death”, Seth Green and Matt Senrich’s hiliarious [adultswim] show “Robot Chicken” took home some TV / Short Form prizes with it’s “Star Wars: Episode II” special, and Matt Groening’s Futurama took home a home video prize with “Beast with a Billion Backs” over “Batman: Gotham Knight” and Disney’s pig-sh*t “Mermaid” prequel.
:S Kung Fu Panda?! really??!!!
IM so shockin’ right now.
EPIC fail, Annie Awards.
There’s no way that these awards can be 100% honest. Shut out WALL-E entirely? There was definitely some political motivation here.
@ Iain:
That’s actually not half-bad of an argument as to why Panda took it when you think about it. Pixar keeps winning and winning so much that I guess the one time every 10 years or so that Dreamworks makes a halfway decent animated movie they have to give it to them for the sake of some variety. Wouldn’t want the haters to think that the Annies are a bunch of Pixar groupies. Still, it shouldn’t have been this year, with this Pixar movie in competition.
Wow I go away for a day and this thread goes all to hell. Everyone attacking Sasha for posting her opinion and defending it needs to chill and get over it. It is HER site where she is able to EXPRESS HER THOUGHTS and OPINIONS on the RACE. If she thinks something is utter bullshit (whether it be an awards body or your comment) she is allowed to express her dislike for it. If you do not agree with her position that is fine. No one is saying you can’t put up your opinion but to tell Sasha that she should check herself is bullshit. If you truly do not like the way Sasha is handling the site go to any of the hundreds of other Oscar sites out there and good luck to you.
Sasha please do not stop answering our comments. I love it when you and Ryan get down and dirty with the rest of us.
I am a little leery of venturing onto here again after all that’s come before, but I’ve been following and sharing comments on this site for several years now, and I would like to say that yes, it is Sasha’s site and she certainly does have a right to express her opinions. It’s just that with this particular thread, it’s a Sasha I’ve never seen before. I’ve always viewed you as our den mother, and I have to say that reading through the entire thread, it was not the Sasha I know and love. I hope it was just an anomaly, that maybe you were having a stressful day, because I would hate for the tone of the site to change.
Wow I wouldn’t have guessed this thread would have brought the anger and insane amount of stoooopid comments.
Can’t we just go back to hating Slumdog again?
“Yes, Dark Knight and Wall-E were the two best films of the year. Deal with it.”
I’ve only newly discovered this site and have found it entertaining and informative during the awards season. I’ve enjoyed Sasha’s passion for the movies that she chooses to champion and respect the right for to do so, seeing that it is her blog. But the above statement isn’t up to her standards. Frankly it’s the kind of stuff you find on aintitcool talkbacks (especially the “Deal with it.”). If she’s talking about end of year awards/nominations/etc, then OK, I get it – there’s a lot of evidence in the statement’s favor. But as a statement of fact…. come on. Yes, the consensus of opinion is that TDK and Wall –E are two of the best received films of the year. That’s as far as you can go.
Subjective opinion of a work of art isn’t a fact. Can never be a fact. From the short time I’ve been reading this blog, I’ve come to expect better.
For what it’s worth, I think the first 30-40 minutes of Wall-E is brilliant – some of the best pure visual storytelling and character building I’ve seen in a long long time. Then the story takes the loveable robot into space and I stopped caring. After all the end of year accolades, I went back and watched it again, to see if there was something I might have missed, and there wasn’t. I think it’s a very good movie, and one third of it is a great movie. Kung Fu Panda doesn’t have the ambition of Wall-E, it’s goals are more modest and in my opinion, it reaches those goals effectively. Wall-E,. on the other hand, falls short of it’s lofty aspirations. I know I’m in the vast minority, but those are my thoughts.
Keep up the good work, Shasha!
Just realized that in my previous comment I have referred to Sasha as a “her” and a “she”. I actually don’t kow Sasha’s gender so if Sasha is a “he”, my apologies for the mistake….
I’ve always assumed Sasha was a “he”, but everyone else is assuming a “she”. Not that gender matters, but perhaps Sasha can clear it up for us…….what do you say, Sasha?
@RJGinCA
Definitely a woman (not an assumption, as regular readers of the blog know).
I’ve always assumed Sasha was a “he”, but everyone else is assuming a “she”. Not that gender matters, but perhaps Sasha can clear it up for us…….what do you say, Sasha?
She.
Those who’ve been with her since her Oscarwatch (TM Copyright etc) days have long known she’s is a ravishing femme fatale (with daughter in tow)
I’ve enjoyed Sasha’s passion for the movies that she chooses to champion and respect the right for to do so, seeing that it is her blog. But the above statement isn’t up to her standards. Frankly it’s the kind of stuff you find on aintitcool talkbacks (especially the “Deal with it.”). If she’s talking about end of year awards/nominations/etc, then OK, I get it – there’s a lot of evidence in the statement’s favor. But as a statement of fact…. come on. Yes, the consensus of opinion is that TDK and Wall –E are two of the best received films of the year. That’s as far as you can go.
Subjective opinion of a work of art isn’t a fact. Can never be a fact. From the short time I’ve been reading this blog, I’ve come to expect better.
Two things I really hate. The first is when people pile on when someone or something is down. Wall-E being shut out of the Annies and people rushing to comment how bad Wall-E was. Dark Knight losing a Best Pic nod and people piling on about how bad it was. First, it shows a lack of compassion in general. Second, it takes the blame off of the people who made the mistake in the first place. Yes, taste is subjective. Yes, art is subjective. But if someone took the top fifty paintings that were considered great and put them in a room and voted on them, if the Potato Eaters didn’t picked as one of the five would people start complaining about how bad it was? No, it would be agreed upon that it was still considered one of the best paintings ever done. I would still say “The Potato Eaters is a great painting, deal with it.” I am not saying that you have to like it, or that you yourself think it is good – but I will not accept your saying it “was bad.” Especially at a time when it’s down. I’m sorry if I came off as rude to most of you or that it isn’t up to my own standards, but I think I would know what my own standards are; after all, I created the site and have done most of its content for the last ten years.
I agree with Sasha. The sudden venom for Wall-E in a MUCH higher ratio that I’ve ever seen anywhere, does suggest some type of gang mentality thing. yes, I’m sure some of you believe your (misguided) opinions but it seems like a sudden chance to jump on something almost universally beloved. People love to do this. All the sudden experts of animation that have appeared as if from ether are certainly amusing to say the least.
“The Potato Eaters is considered by most to be a great painting, deal with it” would be more like it. If someone didn’t like it, they’d be in the minority but that wouldn’t make that opinion invalid, just different. (how much weight you’d give that dissenting opinion – well that’s another story). There are no absolutes when it comes to artistic opinion (or expression). And thank God because how boring woud that be? Art effects everyone differently and discussing/arguing about it with friends (or on sites like this) is part of the fun.
And no piling on here. I think Wall E is a good movie, without a doubt. I’m just not in the camp that finds it to be one of the best movies of the year. And the gasps of indignation because it didn’t win one (fairly minor) award after winning pretty much everything else, seems a little out of proportion. The Oscar is in the bag. It’s pretty much universaly loved and viewed by most as an instant classic. It’s on nearly every top ten list. It’s made a zillion bucks. It’s status is pretty much sealed. What does it matter if a few voices speak up against it. Every other movie gets a little back lash (TDK has taken it’s hits and from what I’ve been reading lately it looks like people are taking shots at Slumdog Millionaire now), and it looks like Wall E isn’t immune.
And sorry about the “come to expect better” in my last post. As I’m so new to the site, I haven’t read enough of your stuff to really make that a fair statement so I was probably a little out of line. I’ll just say that the tone of your “deal with it” statement took me by surprise – that’s all.
Regardless of the merits of one film over the other, it appears that DreamWorks resorted to some shady practices when it came to the Annies.
This comment was posted anonymously on my blog:
“You are so right. Dreamworks purchased membership for the whole company and bought the vote. Pixar only showed up to be gracious, they already knew they were going to be shut-out by the JK ploy. -An Insider”
http://moviedearest.blogspot.com/2009/01/awards-watch-panda-upset-at-annies.html
- kch
It’s a statement: Look! The Pixar regime has ended. We’re free!!!
No film from Pixar will ever win anything again.
All that being said, I’m really looking forward to seeing Up. It’s definitely one of my must-sees (you can’t go wrong with Ed Asner and balloons!)
When is Ryan Adams coming back?
I’m back, Ligaya. Digging out from the Midwest ice storm. I’ll be fully thawed by tomorrow.
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