It must be Oscar ballot time! Remember what I told you, Oscar watchers. The film that usually wins King’s Speech style is the one that people say they love while saying another (bad) movie will win. Happens every year. “Lincoln is so boring it has to win. But I loved that Argo!””The Social Network has won everything, it HAS to win the Oscar but my favorite is The King’s Speech!” That’s the awards race in a nutshell. Perception. It’s all about perception.
Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you, your average BAFTA voter. Meet Toby Young, admitted BAFTA member with a Telegraph piece entitled “Is 12 Years a Slave Torture Porn for Guardian readers? This is when the average voter begins to feel victimized and starts talking about how the movie that’s going to win shouldn’t win.
On Gravity:
Everything you’ve heard about Gravity is true. I actually paid to see it at the cinema in spite of being sent the DVD and it lived up to the hype. It’s mesmerising, spellbinding, thrilling. A thing of beauty. But I can’t see it winning many of the big awards because, essentially, it’s a popcorn movie. Yes, yes, Sandra Bullock is good in the central role, but she’s notthat good and I doubt there’ll be enough feminists among Bafta’s membership who’ll vote for her because, you know, she’s proved that you can still be a female movie star after the age of 40. Best Director? Too much competition in that category. As for the script… no. It’s rubbish.
On American Hustle:
Hands down the best movie of the year. Had me grinning like a baboon from start to finish. Such brio! Such panache! And the performances!!! I’ve been a fan of David O Russell since seeing Flirting With Disaster on the day it came out and if you haven’t ever seen that, you must. It’s like a classic Hollywood screwball comedy starring Cary Grant and Katherine Hepburn. Indeed, I liked it so much that I’ve been disappointed by everything he’s done since, including Silver Linings Playbook, which was pretty darn good. But with American Hustle Russell has finally fulfilled his potential. This is the most gifted director of his generation at the very top of his game – like Coppola with the Godfather II or Scorsese with GoodFellas (and, believe me, The Wolf of Wall Street is no GoodFellas). Should win everything going, but won’t. It’s just too much fun.
On 12 Years:
Torture porn for Guardian readers? I’ll give director Steve McQueen the benefit of the doubt when he says he simply had to include scene after scene of Chiwetel Ejiofor being beaten, whipped, flayed, you name it (not to mention Lupita Nyong’o being beaten, whipped, flayed, etc) becausethat’s what really happened. But, frankly, I got the point after the first 30 minutes. Did he really have to spin it out for three hours? And the hero is so dreary. The one thing that kept me going, as Ejiofor suffers degradation after degradation, was the hope that he’d eventually turn on his torturers and give them a taste of their own medicine, Django Unchained style. But no. McQueen would never be so crass as to stoop to including something cathartic. There’s no vengeance, no sense of release. This is a three-hour civics lesson. It’ll probably win big.
Yeah so that happened.
Once a film is labeled as a frontrunner, and in this case, 12 Years a Slave, suddenly people begin to think “it’s good, it’s not THAT good.” The trick is to fly under the radar Argo and King’s Speech style so no one is looking at you. They think you aren’t a threat so they don’t bother even considering your presence. They just know, I liked that movie but it’s probably not going to win because (fill in the blank of the defacto frontrunner). This is why Kris Tapley’s piece about how voters were surging for 12 Years a Slave makes a difference a crucial time and why that dubious BAFTA article that appeared in the Guardian about their fake voting matters. Those folks across the pond do not have the same rules the Academy does – so basically it’s a hit piece free-for-all.
You all think you know how this race is going to go. I’ve been down this same awful yellow brick road so many times. This story was finished once Kyle Buchanan wrote that 12 Years a Slave was going to win Best Picture right after Telluride. It might look like Oz but there is a little old dude behind the curtain pulling the strings. Best off returning to Kansas.
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“Hands down the best movie of the year. Had me grinning like a baboon from start to finish.”
Well, there you go. Mystery solved, just consider the source.
“People that make judgments such as this are the least knowledgeable as to what a great film really is.”
Yup – same crowd that’s behind sanctioning the giving of wedgies an Olympic sport.
Django Unchained and 12 Years a Slave are two different movies though, you can’t compare the two. Django was more of a comedy of what should have happen with the blacks in the south during the time period. This film though shows something very surreal and raw. I mean the only thing I didn’t like about it was that it was a two and half hour movie when it should have been cut down to two hours. However, I am pretty sure the book was a little bit more detailed and constructive then the movie is. Now I want to read the book and see what was kept in and out of the film.
I agree with you Buford, the problem I believe with people is that they don’t watch a lot of movies and they don’t care enough about the narrative of the film. They also have a specific genre that they are use to seeing as well. It also depends on people’s interest.
There are people who like history and there going to go see historical movie, there are people who love books and most movies are made from books. However, there is another part of people who just want to laugh, be entertained, see cheesy actions scene and be pleased by it.
Like I said before Django and 12 Years are two different movies. I like them both. But you can’t compare them with each other. There in two different worlds really how I see it.
Django is more of a comedic movie then 12 Years where its more surreal and raw.
However, in both movies I got a cringe feel with the whipping scenes and of course the dogs killing the slave in Django, it felt surreal to me and that one scene with the dogs brought me back into history and reality and I think that’s what Tarantino was trying to do in parts of that film Django. However, it was upside history, it never happened. It’s in another world. The same thing happened in 12 Years but for that movie it was so surreal and cringing that I started crying with the whipping scene. It was sad but that’s what he wanted to show to his audience.
But yes I understand people compare apples and oranges all the time, its annoying so that’s why you have to remind them and tell them why its apples and oranges.
It was vile trash and I am so horrified people are saying a great work of art like 12 Years A Slave could have been better if it had emulated the Tarantino film. I can just imagine them saying how boring and dreary Schindler’s List was and lamenting that the Jews never fought back like in Inglorious Basterds. I know there are stupid people everywhere, but I just wish they were not in charge of recognizing the year’s best cinema.
==============================
I agree , it was vile trash and a form of pornography ; it is the type of movie that plants evil thoughts in peoples minds
Says..
“ETC ETC, in regards to “12 years” .. I know there are stupid people everywhere, but I just wish they were not in charge of recognizing the year’s best cinema.” Then you have..”joeyhegele – winner, Comment of the Week,
Does this mean that you and Ryan consider yourself as the best source of recognizing the year’s best cinema. People that make judgments such as this are the least knowledgeable as to what a great film really is. Stop embarrassing yourselves. Better yet stop making fools of yourselves.
joeyhegele: I know there are stupid people everywhere, but I just wish they were not in charge of recognizing the year’s best cinema.
Dbizkid: Does this mean that you and Ryan consider yourself as the best source of recognizing the year’s best cinema.
Bronze Medal, Olympic Leap of Logic
(didn’t quite stick that landing)
American Hustle. “Hands down the best movie of the year. Had me grinning like a baboon from start to finish. Such brio! Such panache! And the performances!!
This guy got it 100 percent correct and I am thinking there are a lot of others who actually vote who are thinking the same way. Wouldn’t surprise me to see “American Hustle” win Best Picture at the OSCARS as well as the BAFTAS because many like myself believe it is the best picture of the year.
“The one thing that kept me going, as Ejiofor suffers degradation after degradation, was the hope that he’d eventually turn on his torturers and give them a taste of their own medicine, Django Unchained style.”
The whole piece was infuriating, but this sentence alone sent me through the roof. He goes on and on about 12 Years A Slave being torture porn, but Django Unchained was far more pornographic in its use of violence. Django Unchained was disgusting and ridiculous — even though it did have very good performances all around — but people liked it because it sated their blood-lust. Audiences were able to watch as a white man helped a black man murder (in many cases it was not self-defense) other white and black men and women. Everyone got to see people of every color being graphically and in some cases comedically massacred.
It was vile trash and I am so horrified people are saying a great work of art like 12 Years A Slave could have been better if it had emulated the Tarantino film. I can just imagine them saying how boring and dreary Schindler’s List was and lamenting that the Jews never fought back like in Inglorious Basterds. I know there are stupid people everywhere, but I just wish they were not in charge of recognizing the year’s best cinema.
joeyhegele – winner, Comment of the Week, in a week of extraordinary comments.
@Paddy Mulholland,
I agree with you about the leaning of BAFTA. But I think they would be better off hiring Graham Norton to officiate. He could bring a much needed if gentle anarchy to the proceedings.
Also, Toby Young is an unpleasant person.
Finally, 12 YEARS A SLAVE is the only worthy winner for 2013.
American Hustle is my favorite of the year. So I’m shallow. I disagree with his comments on 12 Years a Slave though.
My impression of BAFTA has always been that it’s a more left-leaning organisation anyway, perhaps more left-leaning than AMPAS. I feel that the left-wing British media has a stronger feel for the arts than the right-wing British media, and thus has more influence on it. BAFTA doesn’t hire Stephen Fry to officiate their ceremonies for nothing.
I did not like SLAVE. I THINK THIS fellow is right in many…so many ways.
I hate to point out the obvious, but 12 Years A Slave IS the kind of movie that (hopefully) will win the mother load. I don’t think since Schindlers List, has there been a mainstream movie with such profound commentary on history. I know that was Spielberg and if they didn’t give director and picture to him at that point, they would have had riots on the street, but seriously…12 Years is the same kind of movie. A perfect look at history, from the very talented Steve McQueen. It impacts everyone who takes the time to see it. It may not have the rewatch value of some of the others. I’ve watched Schindlers List, about 3 times since 1993. Its still Spielberg’s best film. I watch Jaws and Jurassic Park all the time for fun. It doesn’t take away from the greatness of SL. 12 Years a Slave is not just a movie, but a work of art.
I am also a member of BAFTA and I want to ensure you that Toby Young does not speak for all members. Those in the UK will know that Mr Young is a particular right-wing author who likes to stir controversy, while obviously there are members of BAFTA who are like him they most certainly don’t represent the majority.
I’ve been in London now for a week. And I had a dinner meeting with my friend Carol Chambers and her friend, an unidentified BAFTA voter. Here’s what we were able to conjure out of him after the dessert course was coming our way:
PRIVATE BAFTA VOTER’S CHOICES-
BEST PICTURE: Gravity (He said he felt like an astronaut when he watched it with his grandson!)
BEST BRITISH FILM: Philomena (he claims his wife is still crying about it)
BEST DIRECTOR: Steve McQueen (he felt the vision McQueen had was more powerful)
BEST ACTOR: Leonardo DiCaprio (because secretly he has a crush on him; shhh don’t tell his wife)
BEST ACTRESS: Cate Blanchett (what scandal? This woman not having a lead actress Oscar is the scandal)
BEST SUPPORTING ACTOR: Michael Fassbender (he gave us a similar response to the one he gave for picking DiCaprio)
BEST SUPPORTING ACTRESS: Oprah Winfrey (because she’s so heartbreaking)
We couldn’t get his picks for the Screenplay awards because by then he was well into his Chocolate mousse . Oh!
@ Robert – “Sadly I’ve heard from several people that they felt 12 Years wasn’t a good film because the suffering and pain was “unrelenting.” Basically they want a feel good movie about slavery. ”
This does not surprise me. Most people really can’t deal with the subject of American slavery, we have the American school system to thank for that in aiding in watering down what really happened. This realistic portrayal of the cruelty of slavery, based on a TRUE story just scares the shit out of the weak and feeble minded who think that slaves just got slapped around a bit and only hung up because they tried to runaway. For all the “unrelenting” pain and suffering shown in this film, 12YAS, it truly pales in comparison to the actual pain and suffering real slaves endured.
Not surprised. That’s why BAFTA is irrelevant to me.
Ryan, what about righting this one, too? 😉
”The American equivalent of Toby Jones would be what kind of cretin?”
erp! thanks WW
One vote matters if it’s close. Toby Young could be totally unique in his thinking. Or not. We just don’t know. We’ll probably have more of a clue after BAFTA winners are announced–of course–hindsight being 20/20
Bad news, everyone. It is The Weinstein Company who’s after all going to distribute THE IMITATION GAME in the U.S. So expect along the way of post-production to de-gay and dumb-down the material to maximize accessibility and AMPAS appeal. This *will* happen whether we hear about it or not. I trust the director to execute the fantastically-reviewed script, but he is no Bon Joon-ho to say no to the fat man. Extremely disappointed as one of my most anticipated will be turned into the definition of Oscar bait. What could have been.
The Oscars should be on right about now….all this waiting is torture.
Just b/c Kyle Buchanan said that 12YAS would win the Oscar BP, now it won’t win?
How can ONE man have such an influence? Even if it’s in reverse.
Kyle Buchanan didn’t just write 12 Years would win Best Picture, he wrote that it would win Best Picture, Best Director AND Best Actor. That was a foolhardy call, particularly given the competitive Best Actor race this year. And yes, it put a massive target on the film’s back.
Anyway, it seems as though the most likely bet is with Gravity.
I’ve just read this piece, right after dinner.
I’m not feeling well now.
Aw shit yeh I wrote Toby Jones. What am I like. I always get their names mixed up and I feel like such a fool for doing it because Toby Jones is so cool and talented and Toby Young is such a twat.
Aw shit yeh I wrote Toby Jones.
Wrongs righted, Paddy. Like it never happened.
Sadly I’ve heard from several people that they felt 12 Years wasn’t a good film because the suffering and pain was “unrelenting.” Basically they want a feel good movie about slavery.
I’m fascinated by the love for American Hustle. I’ve been a big fan of many of David O Russell’s films but I found AH to be a mess of a movie, badly edited, and about 30 minutes too long (it felt twice as long to me than 12Years). The only person in the movie who seemed to understand what kind of movie it was supposed to be was Jennifer Lawrence, who was fantastic. It made Argo seem like a work of art. I guess it could win but it just seems too trivial to be a best pic.
Notwithstanding the value of this post, I am OUTRAGED that a picture of Queen Elizabeth II is being used to illustrate this issue. Yes, Her Majesty deservedly won a Bafta for her terrific performance in the 2012 London Olympics Opening Ceremony, but she’s got nothing to do with this controversy! Please don’t drag her into this! I doubt she’s a voting member anyway and she’s supposed to remain neutral. And btw she’s a huge James Bond fan and enjoys testosterone-filled action films, so I doubt she would actually care about those sissy and pseudo-intellectual Bafta-nominated films. Though she strongly supported The King’s Speech…
This is one voter’s opinion out of THOUSANDS.
Agree with Griffin, no need to make a post about ONE VOTER’s opinion, he really didn’t even say anything that inflammatory, he just sounds like a regular dude, not too cultured maybe.
For the record, let’s NOT confuse Toby Young, the writer of the Guardian piece, with Toby Jones, the actor. In fact, Toby Jones is a BAFTA and Golden Globe nominee for ”The Girl” (2002), and he played Truman Capote in ”Infamous” (2006). He’s also a SAG nominee for ”Frost/Nixon” and was the voice of Dobby in ”Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets.”
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0429363/?ref_=nv_sr_1
Grain of salt…like those Entertainment Weekly interviews with anonymous Academy members that always express what we think or fear, but don’t change the consensus.
How is this voters opinion different from the arcticles on this side where Sasha proclaims every 6 days that Gravity is going to win and hiw she tries to sweep 12 Years a Slave under the rug? It’s both the same method. Gosh, I hate this time of the year where everyone tries to impact the race… I wish every award would be given out the same day so we wouldn’t have this nonsense
lol. He is just ONE vote. Since when is ONE vote representative of a whole body of membership?
Why is Sasha giving this guy the time of day? Because this guy HAS A VOTE whether anyone likes it or not–and therefore one has to consider his thinking whether anyone likes it or not–it is certainly interesting to read solely on that basis–whatever his thinking may be based on and whether or not it is “justified.” And then one has to consider how widespread this thinking may or may not be amongst BAFTA members and whether or not AMPAS voters mirror this kind of ideology.
I am not yelling @ Alan D.–I am just emphatic about how, at the end of the day, this guy HAS A VOTE.
Anyone who misspells Katharine Hepburn can be written off immediately, but Sasha has called out the stealth campaign pretty thoroughly. Once you see the pattern it becomes overwhelmingly obvious.
So shoot me I agree with his tastes. I was a little on the fence about American Hustle when I saw it but watching it again yesterday I was able to much more appreciate what an artfully crafted film it is.
However the outcome, I do hope the later Oscar balloting gives AMPAS voters a chance to watch some of the films a second time.
Ultimately, people should be voting for what speaks most to them- not what they think is most “socially important”
Twit or Git? Buford, you’re the expert on UK intelligentsia — which word do I want here?
You want neither. You want failed-aborted-foetus. You want insufferable cuntbag.
Toby Young is known for being hired by TV stations to fill in for bigger, more relevant names who have dropped out of small slots in late-night news chat programmes. The fact that he’s even a member of BAFTA makes me want to find Richard Attenborough and slap him in the face for allowing that to happen. He has about 10 fans in the British public and about -1,010 fans in the British media.
I mean, read what he writes about 12 Years a Slave. He’s not trying to express how he feels about it. He’s not even trying to take the film down (and believe me, Toby Young is the type of person who believes he actually could). He’s trying to provoke. He’s adopting this faux, self-appointed air of intellectual and journalistic gravitas and attempting to fashion himself into a kind of genteel, British Bret Easton Ellis, only even less talented.Twit or Git? Buford, you’re the expert on UK intelligentsia — which word do I want here?
You want neither. You want failed-aborted-foetus. You want insufferable cuntbag.
Toby Young is known for being hired by TV stations to fill in for bigger, more relevant names who have dropped out of small slots in late-night news chat programmes. The fact that he’s even a member of BAFTA makes me want to find Richard Attenborough and slap him in the face for allowing that to happen. He has about 10 fans in the British public and about -1,010 fans in the British media.
I mean, read what he writes about 12 Years a Slave. He’s not trying to express how he feels about it. He’s not even trying to take the film down (and believe me, Toby Young is the type of person who believes he actually could). He’s trying to provoke. He’s adopting this faux, self-appointed air of intellectual and journalistic gravitas and attempting to fashion himself into a kind of genteel, British Bret Easton Ellis, only even less talented.
The question is: why is Sasha giving this guy the time of the day?
This Guy Has A MASSIVE Hard On For American Hustle, But Like You Said, Everyone Has Their Favorites. The Performances were really really Great (At The Expense of The Overall Story) Which has come to define David O. Russell Movies. (Actors First, Story Second)
It actually made me cringe to read this
!2 Years a Slave isn’t even one-hundred forty minutes long, so if this voter watched the movie for three hours I suspect the film was playing at approximately 83% speed or the voter sat and stared at a blank screen for forty minutes, or, or-
Wait I can do this quicker:
“This is a three-hour civics lesson.” <–This is a one-sentence critical thinking disaster.
If I had posted this link and excerpt, I would’ve felt it was my duty to point out that this twit Toby Young is in no way shape or form connected with the film industry in the UK or anywhere else. He’s a loudmouth clown who writes for reality TV and appears as “himself” as a judge on cooking shows in the role of professional asshole. (Twit or Git? Buford, you’re the expert on UK intelligentsia — which word do I want here?)
He’s literally a TV food-taster, a big step down from court jester.
But you know, this shite does serve a purpose. It’s a stark reminder that these distinguished awards bodies we look up to and hope to rely on for their elevated taste and insider insight have allowed their numbers to be infiltrated by reckless culturally-illiterate posers and buffoons. (Infiltrated or infested? Which word best fits? Buffoons or baboons? oh, Toby answered that one already.)
Say what you will about the Academy, but they don’t stoop to including members whose only claim to fame is being a junk-TV celebrity or e-book author.
The American equivalent of Toby Young would be what species of cretin? Pauly Shore? Donald Trump? Snooki’s Baby Daddy?
So, no, I don’t think we need to worry that this halfwit’s perversely pinhead attitude reflects the feelings of many genuinely distinguished members of the BAFTA, the actual filmmakers we respect and admire.
But, yes, I do think it’s good to be aware that the BAFTA isn’t 6500 Ian McKellens and Helen Mirrens.
Be aware. Be very aware.
Toby Young
Now he’s got a blog at The Daily Telegraph, the UK’s rabid right-wing rag. He’s a blogger with a BAFTA ballot.
Don’t forget, you didn’t think Argo was bad!
If 12 yas cannot win I would much prefer AH ; without sounding elitist it’s a movie that should appeal to mature minds more than some sci-fi action thriller ; a movie like that , with that type of populat BO ,is a movie for the masses , the type that the Academy should automatically exclude from it’s BP contenders ; after all , they are supposed to represent high standards of polished , thoughful , cultured movies …the Kings Speech is a good example
“This is a three-hour civics lesson.”
The movie is 2 hrs and 13 minutes. So not sure which version this guy was watching.
Ahhh. I love these 1 person samplers.
This person is an idiot, straight up. His analysis of 12 Years is insulting. And, I hated Gravity, but I find his reasoning for why Bullock won’t win–not enough feminists!!–insulting, at best. American Hustle was a piece of *wink* *wink* *nudge* *nudge* junk too.
12 Years will sweep Baftas.
American Hustle “had me grinning like a baboon…”
Sounds about right.
As much as I try (or more like pretend to try) to appreciate every organization for what it is and respect their obviously subjective choices (sure in reality I LOVE mocking all of them), I can tell you right now I will SERIOUSLY lose my shit if Bafta goes for American Hustle.
So I would say it’s YOU who thinks they know how this race is going to go. 🙂 The rest of us aren’t that sure at all, and rightly so…
And yeah, I don’t know how legit this guy is, but his article sounds quite phony to me too, Bryce.
The postmodern UK is a VERY politically correct, secular country , especially with the political /artsy crowd ; as I’ve wrote before 12 YAS will EASILY win BAFTA and Mcqueen could win BD too
As far as the Guardian reader saying that 12YAS was ”torture porn” there is a bit of truth to that insomuch that it is errily similar to Gibson’s Passion of the Christ and I’ve actually heard it being called the ”Passion of the Slave ” !….well I mean ,watching that gratutious whipping was like doing pennance for past misdeeds , something more to be absorbed , endured ,than actually viewed..instead of leaving the theatre with sombre , sober thoughts about the suffering of Christ you are expected to leave with thoughts of guilt , remorse and empathy for the slaves ; it’s heavy going and I can well understand how some folks can be put off by it
“You all think you know how this race is going to go. I’ve been down this same awful yellow brick road so many times.”
So have we, at least most of us – not as long as you, perhaps, but certainly long enough to know the patterns quite well… And, I can tell you, Gravity fits some patterns, but is way off when it comes to a lot of others as well (the more important ones, if you ask me).
Besides, there isn’t ALWAYS a single possible winner, like you’ve been suggesting for some time now, especially in a year we KNOW to be extremely close (due to the weird guild results). I know you always feel afterwards like whatever won was inevitable, but that’s just Captain Hindsight speaking. 🙂 There have almost certainly (probability dictates it) been very close races in the past that, had 1-2 small things here and there gone the other way, could easily have turned out differently.
To say Gravity fits all the patterns (which it doesn’t, not even close, unless you alone somehow get to pick which patterns matter and which don’t), and will surely win, in a year with such a close race, is extreme, to say the least.
Hmm I just read this guy’s credits on IMDB, and really? really? This is who we’re paying attention to? I’ll wait for Christopher Nolan’s trashing of THE CROODS.
I kind of have a bad feeling about how the BAFTA turns out, but am trying hard to fend it off. Helen Mirren voiced her support for 12YAS, critic Mark Kermode, also a BAFTA member, gushed over 12YAS, giving it five stars. And was it Kris Tapley who said there might be 12YAS sweep-voting? Ugh don’t know. Fingers crossed.
And was it Kris Tapley who said there might be 12YAS sweep-voting?
Yes but that was one person’s opinion, no way of knowing who was voting for what.
OT: Have you read this study?
http://jmi.sagepub.com/content/early/2014/01/27/1056492613519861.full.pdf+html
Long story short: female movie stars reach their maximum salary at age 34, whereas male movie stars reach their maximum salary at age 51…
That’s one voter, and this voter is rather shallow.